Miracles and Fast Church Growth w/ Pastor Joby Martin

Frank Barry:
Hey guys, Frank here with another episode of Modern Church Leader coming to you, uh, you know, with a great guest today, uh, who has a great story and he has a bear on his wall. So. Pastor Joe B, how's it going today?

Joby Martin:
It's going great, man. How are you?

Frank Barry:
I'm doing good, man. I live in San Diego and the sun is kind of out today. So, you know, it's been overcast

Joby Martin:
I'm

Frank Barry:
and.

Joby Martin:
in Jacksonville Beach, Florida, and the sun is also out today.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, I mean, is there a lot of guys in Jacksonville and you're in Jacksonville beach that are like hunters like you? Like

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
I expect

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
you to be in Wyoming or something like that.

Joby Martin:
Nah, Jacksonville is like the capital of South Georgia. So

Frank Barry:
Okay, all right.

Joby Martin:
this is like, this is like the end of the South. If you get more South from us, somehow you end up in the North. Like if you get to Orlando, you might as well be in Queens or something. It's terrible.

Frank Barry:
You

Joby Martin:
Yeah, it's weird.

Frank Barry:
end up in

Joby Martin:
If

Frank Barry:
the

Joby Martin:
you

Frank Barry:
North.

Joby Martin:
go

Frank Barry:
Too

Joby Martin:
to Tampa,

Frank Barry:
good.

Joby Martin:
it's like Ohio. It's

Frank Barry:
Right,

Joby Martin:
not good.

Frank Barry:
right.

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
Yeah. It's too good. Well, man, you have a cool story. We didn't get to meet, but you are at North Coast Church out in Vista, California, teaching at their conference. One of our team connected with you and got you to come on the show. So thanks for joining us. Super appreciate it. And

Joby Martin:
My

Frank Barry:
man,

Joby Martin:
pleasure.

Frank Barry:
I love, you planted a church. You were starting to tell me a little bit of the story. And then we hit record. So I'd love to hear maybe a little more of the story. Like you planted a church a while back and even the precursor to that, you started doing youth ministry and things were going really well. So tell us, give us your journey into ministry and kind of fast forward to today.

Joby Martin:
Yeah, man, this is my 30th year in vocational ministry. So I started when I was 19, I'm 49 now. Didn't really grow up in church, got saved at a summer camp and it was awesome. And then I went home to find a church and it wasn't awesome. And

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
so, I mean, I was like, are we talking about the same Jesus? Cause that guy at camp was awesome. Anyway, so

Frank Barry:
Camp Jesus

Joby Martin:
God,

Frank Barry:
is way more fun.

Joby Martin:
oh man, he's the best. And... And funny enough, he's heaven Jesus, so that'd be good. It's going to be good to see him. So at 19, Phil called the ministry, did student ministry for a long time and moved here to Jacksonville in 03 to be the youth pastor at a church. And in about 2008, we started a brand new service there. We had a bunch of teenagers and a bunch of their parents. And we had a contemporary service and anytime you call it contemporary, it's not, you know what I mean? And so. they put me in charge of a service to kind of reach the gap. And, but I didn't want to do like a, a 20 somethings kind of service. Cause I don't know, man, the concentration of that much ignorance in one room just scared me to death. And so we just ran the service and we started it at 1122.

Frank Barry:
Okay.

Joby Martin:
That's, that's where the name came from.

Frank Barry:
But why 1122?

Joby Martin:
And basic

Frank Barry:
But let's just start with the why did you even do that? Because that came before the name came.

Joby Martin:
because I just thought people could remember that time. Because if you started like, is it 11, is it 1130? Like, when does it start? And so I just said, let's just start at 1122. That's got a ring to it. And then we proof texted the whole Bible. And thankfully Mark 1122 says, "'Jesus answered, have faith in God.'" So we had a verse, so

Frank Barry:
There

Joby Martin:
that was

Frank Barry:
you

Joby Martin:
good.

Frank Barry:
go.

Joby Martin:
And so I got this worship leader in town to come and lead worship. And all we did, he and his wife and me and my wife became like family. I mean, he's still on staff with me now. We do vacations together. I love this family. And we just sit around my kitchen table and we'd all been church staff people for a while. You know, kind of, we were, honestly, we were like the youth pastor critics that would sit in the back row and complain about how lame big church was and be like, if I was in charge, I would never do this and that. And then one day

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
the Lord was like, all right, Scooter, now

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
you're in charge. So,

Frank Barry:
Get out there.

Joby Martin:
yeah. So we just did church. that we always dreamed of. Now, there's, you know, lots of people are doing it, but we just would worship intensely and I would teach the Bible. And I had no idea that people would really show up for it. So anyway, within about a year, it had outgrown the whole church. And then my senior pastor came to me and said, "'I've prayed about this and I have a peace about it, and you should go plant in a church.'" And I thought, that's funny, because I just threw up in my mouth a little. So it's weird how the spirit manifests himself. peace in your life and vomit in mine. So I was

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
like, are you crazy? So he let me stay at our church and exist there as the church of 1122 for like a year and a half while we raised money and found a facility and built it out and

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
figured out things like, we should probably get a bank account and insurance and all that stuff. And then

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
we launched and we launched in the fall of 2013. And. I kind of hesitate to tell church planners my church planting story because I didn't mean to and I don't know what I'm still I don't know how to plant a church.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
So I'm not the God of ass because God was moving in such a significant way. We just had to hold on and not mess it up.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
So I mean opening our very first service we ever had 3,364 people showed up to it.

Frank Barry:
It's incredible.

Joby Martin:
And I thought I hope enough people show up next weekend that we can do it again. And so

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
we've been doing that for. 10 years, 11 years now.

Frank Barry:
I mean,

Joby Martin:
That's it.

Frank Barry:
that's simple, not rocket science.

Joby Martin:
So we meet in our broadcast location is in an old renovated Walmart.

Frank Barry:
Yes, that's amazing.

Joby Martin:
So I teach from layaway. If you're like a millennial and younger, you don't even know what layaway is.

Frank Barry:
No,

Joby Martin:
We used to

Frank Barry:
you

Joby Martin:
have

Frank Barry:
don't.

Joby Martin:
the money first and

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
then

Frank Barry:
but

Joby Martin:
you got your stuff.

Frank Barry:
they know what like a firm is and things like that now, right? It's like the new version of, it's not layaway, but the payment plan and all that kind of thing. So

Joby Martin:
Yeah,

Frank Barry:
it's like,

Joby Martin:
yeah.

Frank Barry:
it's this generation's version of layaway. But I remember Kmart was right by my house.

Joby Martin:
Oh yeah,

Frank Barry:
So I remember layaway.

Joby Martin:
yeah.

Frank Barry:
That was the thing back in the day.

Joby Martin:
Yeah, that was key to Kmart's unbelievable success was the amount of layaway.

Frank Barry:
It's still working today.

Joby Martin:
Kmart is unbelievable. Oh, okay.

Frank Barry:
Oh, that's, I mean, that's pretty cool. What like, give me some of the, I'm sure you've talked about, that's a long journey. It's amazing

Joby Martin:
Really.

Frank Barry:
what God's done. What are some of the things you learned or you have learned over the, you know, that whole experience and I don't know, the first few years of planting the church that you look back on now and go, wow.

Joby Martin:
Uh, yeah, one of the biggest things I learned, and this is especially for all you like, rebellious youth pastor, want to be church planter guys is, um, that you should plant from under authority. Why in the world would you ever expect God to give you any measure of authority until you learn to live under the authority that he has put you under now? And that honor is a decision. Respect is earned and honor is given. And the way you exit one season determines how you enter the next. And so we decided to just do our absolute best to honor the church that was sending us out. And I think that had a lot to do with like the supernatural blessing that we received when we started. And I don't know, nobody ever told me that. You just kinda, I caught that. I wasn't taught that.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah. Was your, you said, you know, you're not a church planner. It doesn't sound like the situation you were in was like a church planting thing, but it just, the senior pastor at that church was like, hey man, you should go do this. Like,

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
was there any DNA? I don't know if you're a part of any denomination or anything like that. Like, was there any DNA into church planning at all or?

Joby Martin:
Yeah, how about this for American church history? So I was on staff at a United Methodist Church, and, but I'm not a Methodist, wasn't a Methodist. And so there was some like, there was definitely some lids to, you know, my future and all that stuff. And so they planted us as a non-denominational, really reformed church. I mean, we're an axiom non-jurch. We're non-denominational, but

Frank Barry:
Okay, yep.

Joby Martin:
I think the Wesley brothers would be rolling over in their graves, but. I think it's the first time ever United Methodists have planted a non-denominational church.

Frank Barry:
Put that in the next book, or maybe it's in one

Joby Martin:
That's,

Frank Barry:
of the first two.

Joby Martin:
yeah, it is, but it's crazy, right? But my senior pastor, his name is Jerry Sweatt, and he's just the best Christian I've ever met in real life. I

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
mean, just straight up, like, he, well, how about this? His son is a youth pastor on staff with me here. That's pretty awesome.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, that is cool.

Joby Martin:
So his son, who was in my youth group at his church, is now my son and daughter's youth pastor here at this one.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, super cool.

Joby Martin:
Super cool.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, so you're still connected with them, it sounds like pretty tight.

Joby Martin:
Oh, very much so, yeah.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah. Man, that's super cool. Okay, so that's one of the lessons, like any other lessons that come to mind where you're like, man, we learned this at the beginning or during the journey.

Joby Martin:
Yeah, there's a lot, man. I mean, we made the decision to be family, to just say, look, our staff is family. We love you. We love your family. You guys matter to us. There's a lot of really bright lights to that. And there's a lot of deep, dark shadows to that. I just think the pain is worth it. So my best friends in the world are the people that I get to work with. And I've been living life with these people for the last 10 or 12 years.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
But you've got to be careful with that too, man. It's hard to fire your sister, but sometimes you have to. And it's hard when you outgrow somebody that you, I mean, you just love them so much and it's just not, it's just not working. And so, and one of the things that I learned is, I mean, man, I'm a Bible preacher, I'm a gospel slinger. So I like to give good news. And by nature, I am an encourager. Well, what I thought were like encouraging, let me breathe some life into you words were heard as promises. So you gotta be really careful with that.

Frank Barry:
Hmm.

Joby Martin:
You know, you could see a guy and be like, bro, and 10 years, I could see this in your life. Well, the moment I said that, he started counting down the calendar. And when he wasn't like the vice president of 1122 at the tenure mark, he's like, but you said, I was like, uh-oh, yeah, I did. No, that's not what I meant.

Frank Barry:
right.

Joby Martin:
I was trying to just encourage you, you know, in some areas, so.

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
I've

Frank Barry:
I

Joby Martin:
had

Frank Barry:
get

Joby Martin:
to

Frank Barry:
it.

Joby Martin:
pay close attention to that. And then it's a really weird thing, especially, I mean, when we started, and still we didn't start normal. We had like 14 staff members on day one. Today we have...

Frank Barry:
Yeah, that's not normal. I would

Joby Martin:
Yeah,

Frank Barry:
go.

Joby Martin:
but but even then it felt like tight like we could all have dinner at my house, right Uh now we have I don't know 300 or something

Frank Barry:
Crazy.

Joby Martin:
So, right. So I meet new staff people at every staff meeting and they're like, oh yeah, I've been working here six months. I'm like, oh, that's neat. It's very nice to meet you. And so, that means people that you used to be in every meeting with now, you only see at the all staff events because that's just the nature of

Frank Barry:
All

Joby Martin:
these

Frank Barry:
right.

Joby Martin:
kinds of things. And so,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
navigating that kind of stuff can be tough.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
Can be tough.

Frank Barry:
What's interesting, church planning, startup business stuff, different but similarities, right? And I remember the same, like we used to meet every Thursday with the whole team. And at the beginning it was four of us and then it was 10 and then it was, and it's like now the whole team meets once a quarter because the whole team can't meet every Thursday. It would waste too much time.

Joby Martin:
Right.

Frank Barry:
But it's a weird thing to go through and same thing. Like when you got people that are with you early who are awesome in that phase and then you gotta, some people can grow with it, some people, it's not their thing and you gotta transition and it's tough so I can totally

Joby Martin:
And

Frank Barry:
resonate.

Joby Martin:
there's this thing too, like the human mind, especially in America, when they primarily see a person on a stage and on screens with lights and cameras and microphones, their mind just puts them in this like celebrity category.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
It just does. And let's say even in the purest version, God does an amazing thing in somebody's life. And I just happened to be the one with the microphone taped to my face when God did the thing. So they began to associate me with that kind of thing. But here's the thing, I've woken up with me every day of my life. I'm the same turd I have always been from the youth ministry days to today. I'm just that guy. And now you live in a context where all these people work for you and serve you and honor you and you know,

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
and those things are fine, but. And then there's that crew that was like setting up chairs with you back in the day and they're like, why are people standing in line for you to sign a book? I don't, I don't understand.

Frank Barry:
Tell

Joby Martin:
I

Frank Barry:
them

Joby Martin:
mean,

Frank Barry:
all to go home. Tell them to stop. They're like,

Joby Martin:
you

Frank Barry:
tell

Joby Martin:
know,

Frank Barry:
them to

Joby Martin:
they're

Frank Barry:
stop.

Joby Martin:
like, they don't, they obviously don't know you very well.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
So there's a lot to it, but

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
man,

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
I mean, I love the team that we have and the culture that we have and, uh,

Frank Barry:
How many

Joby Martin:
I really,

Frank Barry:
of the original,

Joby Martin:
really do.

Frank Barry:
whatever it was, 12 or so, are still on staff with you today?

Joby Martin:
Probably some seven

Frank Barry:
Okay.

Joby Martin:
and probably

Frank Barry:
I mean.

Joby Martin:
all but two or three. If they're not on staff, they still attend here.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah, that's pretty

Joby Martin:
Like

Frank Barry:
cool.

Joby Martin:
we've had, we had some mamas go home to raise babies. Some have planted churches. There's only a, there's only a couple, let me think. I mean, there's only a couple that aren't connected somehow with us still, either as a partner or a member of the church now or

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
yeah.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, that's very cool. That's very

Joby Martin:
Yeah,

Frank Barry:
cool.

Joby Martin:
it's yeah, God's been good to us.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, man, it's an amazing story. Just unpacking it. What else? Like, this is just fun. Like, what else have you learned over the 12 years? Like, you're sort of eluding, like, there's the early days and what it was like, and then there's now, you know. How has it been for you to transition over time through that kind of growth? And, you know. Yeah, it was big at the beginning, but now it's a lot bigger and you got a bunch more staff and you meet people that are new and you don't know their names yet and all that kind of stuff like what's

Joby Martin:
Well, at first, you know, everybody's sort of a generalist and everything is everybody's responsibility. I can remember in an early meeting, we're all there. Everybody that works there is in the meeting. I was like, all right, look around, we're they. So I don't wanna hear, they didn't set up my room because here they are. So

Frank Barry:
I'm ready.

Joby Martin:
this is us, you know?

Frank Barry:
Yep.

Joby Martin:
Well then, very shortly, you've gotta begin to bring in experts that are really good and talented in certain areas. And regardless of what you want to do, you better figure out real quickly what your unique contribution is and what you're best at. And focus not only the most amount of time on it, but your best time and energy, like best time of the day, best time of the week, that kind of stuff

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
on it. For the sake of the church, for the edification of the church, not your own edification. And so, you know. What that means too as a leader is oftentimes you feel like you have no idea what's going on all over the place. And that's probably right and probably very healthy. Very healthy to let to hire in some people better at you in those arenas and then just turn them over and let them go. And then with that, most people in leadership positions wait. way too long to raise somebody up and actually hand over responsibility and decision-making rights. Cause they think, well, that person's not ready. Let's be honest, were you ready when you got the responsibility that you have? Right, man.

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
Do you think Peter

Frank Barry:
not even

Joby Martin:
was

Frank Barry:
close.

Joby Martin:
ready?

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
Jesus gave him the keys to the kingdom of God right after like in the accessory of Philippi.

Frank Barry:
Yup.

Joby Martin:
On the same page, he gets called the devil. So obviously he wasn't like all the way mature

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
and ready to go. But

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
if you wait until It's time, you're probably way too late.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah. Was it hard for you in different stages to let go of control?

Joby Martin:
Yeah, and some things.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
And then, but as the lead pastor, there's still a couple of things that I can, I have to know everything about. I just, it just can't be everything.

Frank Barry:
Right. Are there areas that you found whether it's like you should know or that's just like you're you have an attachment to a certain thing so you like to still stay involved in it?

Joby Martin:
One of them is I think I should know and the other one is just my preference. And so for me, the weekend worship services, you better not move a light without me knowing what's happening.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
Or you don't get to just change a song because you felt like it, because the spirit told you, guess what? I know him too. So check with me and I'll ask him and let's just double check on that one. All right,

Frank Barry:
Yup.

Joby Martin:
that kind of stuff. And the reason that one... functionally makes sense is because Look if we're Nike the weekend service is shoes

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
it runs everything and So I'm I am fully involved in all of that and then a few years ago We brought a retreat center about an hour from here because I think the problem with adult discipleship is adults quit going to camp and You know we look at too many screens and breathe too much air conditioner, and so we bought this this property about an hour from here, it's about 3000 acres and it's got cabins and it's incredible.

Frank Barry:
Sounds cool.

Joby Martin:
And oh my gosh, it's the best place ever. And I just love it and I wanna make sure it goes right. And so I keep a real close eye on it,

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah,

Joby Martin:
but

Frank Barry:
you're

Joby Martin:
that's

Frank Barry:
like,

Joby Martin:
just personal preference.

Frank Barry:
that's my

Joby Martin:
Yeah, yeah,

Frank Barry:
baby.

Joby Martin:
yeah,

Frank Barry:
Like, yeah, I get it, I get it,

Joby Martin:
yeah,

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
yeah.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, and some of this is I'm like legitimately asking because I feel like, again, there's this similarity to, you know, tidally growing and just the stuff you go through and there's stuff that you like and that you're into and stuff that you should know and, you know, letting go and control, I think is hard for anybody. That's something's growing. If you're playing any church planner out there or it doesn't have to be a church planner, anybody that took over a church. Right? Like through succession and then it, but it's growing. And then you have to give up control or do different things. Like it can be a hard transition to go through. And hiring is also super important. Like you mentioned, you got to bring in the specialists. It's different than starting with your kind of your friend group or your, whatever, like your close crew. And now I got to hire outside people and bring in specialists. What's that been like?

Joby Martin:
It's a crap shoot, man. I don't care who you use. I don't care how many personality things you do.

Frank Barry:
Yup.

Joby Martin:
I mean, the only one that's a hundred percent is like, you know, the disciples got it right. They prayed and cast lots and that

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
worked out good for them. But even that, Jesus picked one guy wrong. I mean, I know he was right because he played a role, but you know what I mean.

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
It's a crap

Frank Barry:
get it.

Joby Martin:
shoot. So we try to grow from the inside. We try to stay somewhere around the light. Let's hire 70% or so from the inside, but. with our growth, we just hadn't had time to grow people up sometimes. So then after we look through who's here already, then our next step is try to hire our cousins,

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
like guys that you did camp with back in the day

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
or

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
that kind of stuff. Or, I mean, dude, make no bones about it. Every time you see me at a conference, I got a couple of my guys with me there. as my like travel companions and they are straight trying to snipe the best people they can find. Cause I figured

Frank Barry:
I get

Joby Martin:
like

Frank Barry:
it.

Joby Martin:
if you would, if you would pay money to go to a conference that they paid me to come speak at you at least, or at least somewhat in line with who we are.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, right.

Joby Martin:
And so it's, you know, that you've at least passed, you know, one initial test.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah,

Joby Martin:
So

Frank Barry:
you're around

Joby Martin:
yeah,

Frank Barry:
a little

Joby Martin:
so we're

Frank Barry:
bit.

Joby Martin:
constantly looking.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, that's a, and we were joking before, right? Like I probably wouldn't get hired at Tisley today and you brought it up, right? Like, you know, it's gotten so much bigger and I hate using this word in the church context, but you know, more professional, more grownup, more all the things

Joby Martin:
No, I

Frank Barry:
like.

Joby Martin:
wouldn't hate that. I'm pro that. In fact, part of the reason here, I didn't wanna be like, there's churches that have what they call an honor culture, which in my opinion is just weird.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
You know what I mean? And I've been to those churches and I preach those. They're fun to go preach at. They like pick you up from your truck and carry you in and bathe you in gifts. I mean, so it's super fun, but that's kind of weird. So anyway. But when we planted the church, I was 38 years old and I felt like, like the first staff meeting, I felt like it was prom, like I had my dad's suit on,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
trying to act like a grownup.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
And I was like, man, we've got to act like we know what we're doing, we've got to be more professional than we actually are behind

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
closed doors,

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
particularly

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
with one another. One of the simple things that we did, nowhere is it written in any of our bylaws or anything, there's no rules on this. But I called every pastor pastor and called every elder elder and just publicly honored them all the time.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
You know, like let's just treat each other like grownups. And and it was amazing the positive impact that had

Frank Barry:
Yeah, like it rippled

Joby Martin:
even the way

Frank Barry:
through.

Joby Martin:
we totally man now we cut up with the best of them, but it just it just needs to be the right the right context, you

Frank Barry:
When

Joby Martin:
know.

Frank Barry:
you're at camp, that's when you go to the camp and you know, you go hunting,

Joby Martin:
That's

Frank Barry:
you

Joby Martin:
it man.

Frank Barry:
have other avenues.

Joby Martin:
Totally, totally. But, and then I made some hires. I hired one of my kids preschool directors. And she's, I don't know, 15 years older than me. Everything she did was just incredible. Like she'd run the little preschool Christmas dinner and it would be like you're at Ruth Chris. I was

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
like, holy moly. Her name's Juanita Hamilton. I was like, Miss Nita? I want to hire you to come work at 1122." And she was like, what am I going to do? I was like, just make everything better. That's what I need you to do. Just whatever we're doing, you just add your class. Cause it kind of smells like a fraternity house over there right now. I need you to class this thing up a little bit. And

Frank Barry:
That's

Joby Martin:
so

Frank Barry:
incredible.

Joby Martin:
we made some moves like that because we also, from the very beginning, we were even though we're a younger church compared to regular church,

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
but we have been an intergenerational church from day one. And So we want to make sure that we were acting the part.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love the hire you mentioned, just come make it better. Was that, it sounds like that was like, you're like, just come do it. But in one way, is that, was that hard? Or is that hard for other people on staff to be like, oh, there's a person here whose job is literally just to make us all better.

Joby Martin:
Well, she was already a legend and everybody loved her. So

Frank Barry:
Okay.

Joby Martin:
she, her personality made it.

Frank Barry:
Easy.

Joby Martin:
She didn't do it. She's so excited to serve. It never came across like, cause I tell you, you tech people, you know that moment when dumb guys like me don't know what to do and you go move. Okay. She never did that. She

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
just came alongside and be like, oh wow, that's really cute. But

Frank Barry:
Pastor

Joby Martin:
how about

Frank Barry:
Jovi,

Joby Martin:
we

Frank Barry:
let

Joby Martin:
also,

Frank Barry:
me, God.

Joby Martin:
that's. let's put some tablecloths on these tables since we're doing this level of an event. I was like, yeah, that's what I'm talking about. So

Frank Barry:
Oh,

Joby Martin:
she

Frank Barry:
dude,

Joby Martin:
was great.

Frank Barry:
I love the whole story. It's quite amazing. So how have you guys grown? Like, are you all still multi-campus in the same area? Like, do you have campus pastors at different locations? Are you in the same state? Are you going out of state? Like, what's all that look like over the years?

Joby Martin:
Yeah, we're in 11 locations right now and three more under construction.

Frank Barry:
Crazy.

Joby Martin:
We're, yeah, it is crazy. Three of them in prisons, which is super awesome. Our vision is that we are a movement for all people to discover and deepen our relationship with Jesus Christ. So part of

Frank Barry:
Amen.

Joby Martin:
the secret sauce here is we do not bifurcate between lost people and Christians. We think the church is for God and we think God loves it. when people deepen their relationship with Him. And we also, I'm the County Calvinist to thank God, delights in saving people, okay? So, we've partnered with our people years ago, man, years ago, the guy that led me to Christ, he was a football coach that took me to the camp I got saved at. When he died, the guy that did his eulogy preached on Acts 11, 24. And it says, and he was a good man, full of the Holy Spirit and faith, and a great number of people were brought to the Lord. So I got that tattooed on me. And then I was teaching on it and I was like, listen, man, a great number in the kingdom of God is not a bunch of people. A great number is just one more. So I need every single one of you identify your one more and start praying that God would use you to lead your one more to Christ. And then we partnered with our people to identify the one more weekends and all that. I mean, you can bring your friend to church whenever, but

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
you know on a one more weekend, I am going to. at the end of the sermon, give an opportunity for you to surrender your life to Christ. So because when I was in college, I was leading my fraternity brothers to Christ and I thought, oh crap, what do I do with them now? I can't take it on my church. They don't have pleaded khakis. Like, what are they going to do? And so it wouldn't work. And so we did that. And then we have aggressively made room for one more all the time. And, and so that's been multi-site. and they're all video venues. They all have campus pastors. And the primary job of the campus pastors is just to connect and disciple people. Dude, it's the sweetest job on the planet, by the way. If you love people and you love making disciples, you should be a campus pastor

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
here.

Frank Barry:
Because

Joby Martin:
Because,

Frank Barry:
all the administrative

Joby Martin:
that's it.

Frank Barry:
overhead or whatever, I don't know what to call it, is all taken care of.

Joby Martin:
Bro, we are centralized like the Death Star around

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
here, okay?

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
Your job, you don't have to figure out insurance and parking and we got all that figured out, man. What I need you to do is shepherd those people at that campus and get people connected, help people take next steps, care for people well, just

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
that, you

Frank Barry:
Yep.

Joby Martin:
know, I tell them, I was like, you should gain 15 pounds when you become a campus pastor because you eat two breakfasts and two lunches every day because you're just gonna meet with people all

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
the time.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
And if you're a golfer, you know, your handicap is going to go down by 10 because you can play golf all the time with people. So just be with people, man. So we've done that.

Frank Barry:
The

Joby Martin:
And then

Frank Barry:
job

Joby Martin:
lately.

Frank Barry:
description sounds amazing.

Joby Martin:
It is, see, I told you, that's how I hire people. Some of your people are going to reach out to me right now.

Frank Barry:
There it was.

Joby Martin:
And now we're in. We've got a campus up in Georgia. We're looking at maybe moving to Orlando. There's. Man, there's about 250 people meeting in Sarasota, Florida. That's just south of Tampa, which is probably like three hours from here. There's about 200 adults meeting on Friday nights who have just declared they are the church of 1122. So we kind of got to even figure that out.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
Like,

Frank Barry:
Isn't that amazing? Like

Joby Martin:
you

Frank Barry:
that's

Joby Martin:
know.

Frank Barry:
amazing to me when I've heard stories of

Joby Martin:
It's

Frank Barry:
that,

Joby Martin:
crazy.

Frank Barry:
you know, like North Coast. I've heard that specifically with them, you know, because we helped them with some of their tech, but they're like, hey, we have these like locations that just pop up. We know there's a bunch of people over here. And

Joby Martin:
Totally.

Frank Barry:
like sometimes it's like, oh, they're renting a school like on their own

Joby Martin:
Right.

Frank Barry:
meeting.

Joby Martin:
So this was cool. North Coast has a campus, is it called Ramona or

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
something like

Frank Barry:
Ramona,

Joby Martin:
that

Frank Barry:
yep.

Joby Martin:
near you?

Frank Barry:
Yep.

Joby Martin:
Okay. So apparently there's more rednecks in Ramona than San Diego. And so is

Frank Barry:
Yes,

Joby Martin:
that true? Okay.

Frank Barry:
very true.

Joby Martin:
So years ago, the Ramona crew reached out to us. They were using all 1122 stuff and they flew out here and the guys in charge were entrepreneurs. So they had resources and they knew what they were doing and they know how to get stuff done. And they were like, listen, if we could do an 1122 into Ramona, I promise you it would blow up by tomorrow. And I'm like, well, where is that? And they're like, oh, we're just outside of San Diego. And I'm like, well, hold on. I got a church friend. You know, Larry Osborne at North Coast. You should just do what you're doing, but just do it with them. Cause we're all like, it's

Frank Barry:
they're

Joby Martin:
all same

Frank Barry:
right

Joby Martin:
team.

Frank Barry:
there. Yeah.

Joby Martin:
It wouldn't even be that different. So we called Larry and Chris and made the introduction and then- That's how that thing came into existence. How cool is that? So it doesn't

Frank Barry:
That's

Joby Martin:
have to be

Frank Barry:
amazing.

Joby Martin:
1122. I don't care if it's,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
we have the dumbest church name ever. So it doesn't matter,

Frank Barry:
But like

Joby Martin:
but

Frank Barry:
I said

Joby Martin:
we just.

Frank Barry:
earlier, like your name, you know, might've been crazy and just, you know, it's the time, but you are ahead of your time. It's one of the most creative

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
church names out there now.

Joby Martin:
Well, part of what happened too when we first started is I led this guy to Christ that owned a skate park and it was called Skate Lab. And he'd make all of these Skate Lab, like skate stickers, you know? So he just made this 1122 logo and brought me one of those die cut stickers. He's

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
like, can I give these out? I was like, yeah, man, yeah, as long as I can get one. Well, after a couple of years, no joke, they were probably... 10 to 12,000 stickers on cars and stuff all over the city. And nobody, they didn't, people didn't even know it was a church.

Frank Barry:
Right. Cause it just had like 1122,

Joby Martin:
The amount, it just says

Frank Barry:
like

Joby Martin:
1122

Frank Barry:
just. Yeah.

Joby Martin:
and it looks cool. And it was like a white car, you know, windshield sticker, whatever, rear window sticker. I can't tell you the number of people that would just see all the stickers, Google what is 1122, be like, oh, that's interesting. Maybe we'll check it out. Like we hear about it in our baptism videos.

Frank Barry:
All the time, yeah.

Joby Martin:
all the time.

Frank Barry:
That's so

Joby Martin:
It's

Frank Barry:
cool.

Joby Martin:
crazy.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, hey, branding, man. Some

Joby Martin:
I

Frank Barry:
people,

Joby Martin:
know.

Frank Barry:
so, you know, people, you know, think church and marketing and all the kind of things is weird, but you know, it's marketing, it's branding. It's, it brought people to the church and then they're getting saved. So it's a big deal.

Joby Martin:
Yeah, and we have zero dollars in our marketing budget because there's things like that. It's just like, that was just, a guy just did it, you know?

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
It was just organic, it was awesome.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
So.

Frank Barry:
Yeah. That's, that's crazy. Okay. You also wrote a book. So let's just spend a few minutes. I want to be respectful of your time. So we'll speed through it. But you wrote you wrote in a couple books, but your newest book, Anything Is Possible is amazing. So what inspired you to write the book? You know,

Joby Martin:
Well.

Frank Barry:
what was it like writing a book to I mean, it's a lot of work.

Joby Martin:
I really, I really, well, man, I've been preaching, like I said, I've been preaching for, I've preached pretty much every week except for like vacation or whatever for the last 30 years. So, you know, you get all this stored up content and when your church blows up, everybody's like, you know, you should write a book, you should write a book. And I was like, nah, not yet. So I really wanted to wait until I felt like the Lord said it's time. And just in, The way I think about the two books that I've written, it's really like a two piece set. Cause book one is called, if the tomb is empty and book two is anything is possible.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joby Martin:
And in pastoring people, I can't tell you the number of folks that would come to me and say, pastor, I am in an impossible situation. Like my marriage is impossible. And I would take them back to the empty tomb. I'd be like, hold on, but you're a believer, right? Right. You believe that God. Physically raised bodily raised Jesus out of the grave. They're like, of course, I believe that I'm like, okay And then one day I just said it I was like well if the tomb is empty Then anything is possible like if he can breathe new life into his dead son surely he can breathe new life into your dead marriage and so that's where the idea came from and

Frank Barry:
Amen.

Joby Martin:
So book one if the tomb is empty we chase seven mountains in the scriptures. We start on Mount Moriah, we end on Mount Calvary, which most believers don't know is the same mountain. And we just track through God's hand in the Bible through these mountains. And we find a mountain that holds a tomb, but the tomb can't hold a body. So that's book one. And then book two is like the application of it.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
I felt like the Bible teaching evangelical church needed a gospel saturated book on the miraculous. One, because I've read the Bible cover to cover and can't find term limits on the Holy Spirit, so I still think he does what he does, you know.

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
There's no expiration date there.

Frank Barry:
yep.

Joby Martin:
But two, a lot of folks that focus on the miracles, that's exactly the problem. They focus on the miracles and not the miracle maker. And so these are not, we study nine different miracles that really reveal God's heart.

Frank Barry:
Hmm

Joby Martin:
Because the miracles aren't about the miracles, they always point it to the message. Like Jesus, well in the book of John, They're not even called miracles. They're always called signs because signs point to something greater than themselves.

Frank Barry:
Right, yeah.

Joby Martin:
And Jesus wasn't just trying to like flex his raw power. He was always pointing to God's redemptive purpose. And so we just, the anchor is the greatest miracle of all time that Jesus came out of the grave.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
And you know, Romans eight says, if he did not hold back his own son, then can't we believe him for all things? And then there's also a chapter on what do you do when God doesn't do what you think he would do if he

Frank Barry:
Yes.

Joby Martin:
would just listen to you,

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
right?

Frank Barry:
that's the book everyone's gonna have like, you know, rabbit ear and book. Because

Joby Martin:
And then

Frank Barry:
that's hard.

Joby Martin:
interest, yeah, and then, and then interestingly enough, and so where I go is in John chapter six, there's actually two miracles. There's the feeding of the 5,000 and the walking, and walking on water. But John six is where Jesus gets all crazy with his teaching and starts saying, unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no part with me.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
And everybody starts to leave. And he doesn't even explain it. I mean, post resurrection, we know, He's talking about the gospel. And we're not actually eating his flesh and drinking his blood. We're taking communion to remember the gospel. And if you don't have the gospel, you don't have him. I mean, that's what he's saying. But he explains none of it. And you gotta imagine, Peter is thinking, I have made a horrible career decision. Like, what am I doing? And Jesus says, do you wanna leave too?

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
Cause he knows he's like, yeah, I kinda do. And Peter's answer, man, is what you do when you don't get your miracle. He says, well, to whom shall we go for you're the only one that offers eternal life. And then he says, because we have come to believe and know that you are the Christ. Most Americans want to know and then see if they're going to believe or not. But the offer, the offer from our heavenly father is no, no, no, no. You're going to believe. And then as you are on the way, there's some things you will come to know. And so. And then while I was right in the middle of writing this book, I'm on a red stag hunt in Scotland with some of my best friends. And my best friend dies of a heart attack in the Highlands as I'm writing a book on the miraculous. So what do you do? What do you do?

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
I can tell you what you do. You just got to pick up your faith and pick up your doubts and pick up your unanswered questions and do exactly what Peter said. Where is somebody going to go?

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
and you just keep following after Jesus. And then also during the same time period when I was writing this, I experienced the other end of it. The family that I talked about, our original worship leader that I vacationed with and all that, his name's Ben Williams, we're on vacation together at Disney and he has a grand mal seizure, it's a brain scan, and he's got a cancerous brain tumor. This was on a Thursday

Frank Barry:
Oh my gosh.

Joby Martin:
and they tell him, You got about six months of normal life left. Within 18 months, you'll be in hospice. So, I mean, bro, he's got two girls. He sent me this text before he went into brain surgery. And it was like, all right, man, if I don't make it out, you got to take care of my girls. I was like, bro, you're gonna be fine. He's like, I get it. And he says this, he goes, well, they're gonna need leadership. You're the best one I know. And I was like, all right, I got you. But you know, you're gonna be all right. So they tell him that on a Thursday. That was at a hospital in Orlando. We had the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville. And one of the great things about pastoring a real big church is you own nothing and you have access to everything.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
So like I know all the Mayo people.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
So I was like, y'all, y'all got to get Pastor Ben in here. So we get him from Orlando, get him up here. They do a bunch of tests. They do brain surgery. He comes out of brain surgery and they're like, I think we got it. I think you're going to be fine. That surgery was two and a half years ago. He is cancer free, tumor free.

Frank Barry:
Amazing.

Joby Martin:
This past weekend, he should be in hospice. He went in hospice. He was in the Atlantic Ocean with me. This last weekend, we baptized 1,125 people and he was out there dunking people and still leading worship.

Frank Barry:
That's

Joby Martin:
So,

Frank Barry:
incredible.

Joby Martin:
so, so this book handles like all the breadth of the work of God

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
in our lives and our proper response. What do you do, man?

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
You just worship him. whether you get what you want or don't get what you're asked for. The key is that you get him.

Frank Barry:
Hmm. Yeah.

Joby Martin:
I mean, that's the key. That's the abundant life is you

Frank Barry:
It's

Joby Martin:
get

Frank Barry:
hard,

Joby Martin:
him.

Frank Barry:
right? It's hard helping people like, get to that place, I guess. Right? Like, it's about our relationship with God. It's about like knowing him growing, raising your family in that all the things not what you get or don't get. But like, I don't know, we're Americans. It's

Joby Martin:
Yeah, um... Yeah, one of the things I learned writing this book is tragedy and trauma will test what your actual theology is.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
You know, like you, I mean, I'm a preacher, man. So I know what I preach and I just preach the Bible. So I'm, you know, but are you really smoking what you're selling?

Frank Barry:
Right. Yeah.

Joby Martin:
And I'm, I ain't gonna lie. When my friend Bradley went down, all I could think about, well, first it was terrible. We had like. bringing all his stuff home and we're in Scotland. And I mean, it's just a train wreck anyway. I was supposed to be on sabbatical during that time.

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
And all your like sabbatical coaches will say, well, you got to stay away from your church. Cause if you go to your church, they're gonna make you work. And I was like, yeah, whatever, bro. All I can think about is I want to be in this place with these people. Luckily, because it was my sabbatical, I had like eight of my buddies who are the best preachers on the planet. They were lined up to preach. It was like Matt Chandler and David Platt and just some,

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
you know, Ben Stewart,

Frank Barry:
you're

Joby Martin:
just

Frank Barry:
solid.

Joby Martin:
rock stars,

Frank Barry:
You had

Joby Martin:
right?

Frank Barry:
that covered.

Joby Martin:
And all I wanted to do was show up, man. I just wanted to come to church and pray the prayers, sing the songs, hear the word preached. And we have like a super responsive culture. We got these like prayer benches down front, and we make a big deal out of like the response to the message to what God's doing. And I just wanted to get down there to that altar and pray. And though I mean, I cried a million tears or whatever, it still makes me sad.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, man, of course.

Joby Martin:
But I never, I don't know, man, God is sovereign and I know he's in charge and I know he's good. And I can still believe Romans 8.28 that he's at work in all things.

Frank Barry:
Right?

Joby Martin:
And also I'm confident there will come a day and he's gonna peel back the curtain and I'm gonna step into eternity. And right now I only see just do a smudge glass and then I'm gonna see clearly and I'm gonna get there and I'm gonna be like, look at you, you did it again. I had no idea how you were working all of this for your glory, but now I see clearly how you were in charge of all things.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah. It's beautiful, it's hard, it's like, but helping people like you're doing in the books and the church and, you know, like stay focused in the right place, like, it's just massive, you know. And, you know, I mean, I think about it, like, there's all, you know, you have stuff in your life, we all have stuff in our lives where it's like, those are the things that'll like drive you to God more and deeper. or you know, it kind of like shows you're two character, you'll go the other way, right? But it's like, where

Joby Martin:
It's

Frank Barry:
do you go?

Joby Martin:
usually a dividing line.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah,

Joby Martin:
Pain

Frank Barry:
where

Joby Martin:
is

Frank Barry:
do you go?

Joby Martin:
usually a,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
yeah, it's a watershed. You either run to him or away from him. The thing is, is anybody that I've ever seen get angry at God because he didn't do what they thought he should do? Which I get, and I'm not trying to minimize it, man.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
We're talking about people losing kids or battle infertility or, you know. When they do run away from him, they still don't find answers or peace or hope. They don't find any of the things they're looking for. They just get beat up by an enemy who only wants to steal, kill, and destroy. And isolation is one of his favorite tactics.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, oh yeah.

Joby Martin:
I mean, the enemy says, I mean, the Bible says that he prowls around like a roaring lion seeking someone to devour. If you've ever watched Animal Planet, if you find that one antelope that's not with the group, it's dead.

Frank Barry:
done.

Joby Martin:
Like you don't even have to watch the end of the show. The lion is gonna snipe that

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
one.

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
And,

Frank Barry:
I mean, could you imagine

Joby Martin:
but those.

Frank Barry:
though, like this is the thing, like I think about, you know, a handful of hard times, right? And you're like, could you imagine not having God's way, right? Like the church, your friends, praying, like the ability to go to him, like the scripture to read and get comfort and encouragement and faith and like not having those pieces and just trying to do it on your own and go isolate, like... I just feel that makes me like sad for people because that's such a hard

Joby Martin:
Thanks for watching!

Frank Barry:
It just seems so much harder compared to what God gives us to go through that stuff with

Joby Martin:
Yeah, I was in Israel recently. We do trips to Israel every other year, which are awesome. And we're in the Garden of Gethsemane, right? And as I'm reading through that passage there, it dawned on me that if Jesus, so he gets the disciples, "'Hey, Peter, James, John, "'you all come a little farther and pray for me.'" And he's overwhelmed and overcome with the sense of what he's about to walk through. And... The second person of the Trinity who is preeminent spoke everything into existence by his power holds all things together that are Inexistence whether visible or invisible He felt like I need some help with this. I need some guys. I need some of my brothers praying for me All right. So if Jesus needs a band of brothers praying for him Then who in the world do you think you are? Do you think

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
I got this?

Frank Barry:
right.

Joby Martin:
I don't need anybody you out of your mind, man

Frank Barry:
Yeah, absolutely.

Joby Martin:
The enemy's got you teed up, about to take you out.

Frank Barry:
I think it's because people, I don't know this, like, but you know, I think people get afraid, right? To let, to call them in and to get your brothers with you and to tell people what's going on. And it's easier to hide from it sometimes for some people, I guess. I don't know. Sad.

Joby Martin:
I mean, I think you're dead on. One of the things we do here at our church, we try. I mean, like authenticity is not a strategy for us. We

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
try, you know what I mean? I'm the first to admit, like in the middle of the sermon, I'm the worst sinner I know. And the reason I'm the worst sinner I know is the, cause I know every, see, you only know the sins that you've seen me commit like on. Instagram I know the ones that like are only in my head and in my heart man I know I'm a mess and need help and the fake yous doing just fine. You can leave her on Instagram She

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
looks great,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
but the but the real you needs a real Jesus who died on a real cross for the real you man. So That's what one of the things great about planning your own church is You can make it as real as you want to. And it's pretty grimy around 1122,

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
man. I mean, it is grimy and I love it. I mean, I really, really love it.

Frank Barry:
That's incredible, man. Well, Pastor Jobie, this has been awesome. I wanna be respectful of time. Can I ask you a couple rapid fire questions, quick ones?

Joby Martin:
Yes, sir. No problem.

Frank Barry:
We'll start with the first one. Now we'll end with that one. What's a book that everybody should read?

Joby Martin:
Every pastor should read The Pastor's Kid by Barnabas Piper.

Frank Barry:
pastor's kid, okay.

Joby Martin:
Have you read

Frank Barry:
Is

Joby Martin:
it?

Frank Barry:
it about, I have not read it. That's

Joby Martin:
Bro.

Frank Barry:
actually the first time I've heard of that one. Is it about raising kids as a pastor or?

Joby Martin:
It's about Barnabas Piper is John Piper's son and he loves his dad and he appreciates, this is not a hit piece on his dad whatsoever, but it is an honest look at the price that the kids of pastors

Frank Barry:
Mm-hmm.

Joby Martin:
have to pay.

Frank Barry:
That's amazing.

Joby Martin:
And it ran over me like a freight train, man. I had all my elders read it, had all my pastors read it. My wife and I read it together. We shared a bunch of it with our kids.

Frank Barry:
Yeah.

Joby Martin:
So if you're in the ministry, and I think there's a lot, I think there's a lot you can learn if you're a believer and you're like the boss or the CEO, like people know who your kid is. There's probably a lot that folks could learn from that.

Frank Barry:
Yeah, I love that.

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
Great. Second

Joby Martin:
That's

Frank Barry:
one,

Joby Martin:
one.

Frank Barry:
podcasts that you're listening to right now.

Joby Martin:
I listened to The Undaunted Life by Kyle Thomas is equipping men to push back darkness. And honestly, man, my son loves Joe Rogan and I'm like, what are you doing? And I was trying to just find for him some kind of redemptive alternative, you know

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
what I mean?

Frank Barry:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joby Martin:
And I'm not, and here's the thing, he's 17 years old. I'm not gonna like tell him he. what he can and can't listen to, because that's futile anyway, right? But I was trying to find something, and then I went on that one a couple of times, and then got to know Kyle, and it's really legit.

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
I listened to that one a lot.

Frank Barry:
yeah, I love that. Are there any, you know, non-Christian or faith kind of based podcasts, not Joe Rogan necessarily, but any other ones? Do you like, are there business ones or like things like that that you're like, these ones scratch and itch for me that I'm really interested in.

Joby Martin:
Uh, just, just a hunting podcast.

Frank Barry:
There you go.

Joby Martin:
Like that's

Frank Barry:
That's fine.

Joby Martin:
all I, you know, not really. There's so much like

Frank Barry:
Uh-uh.

Joby Martin:
leadership stuff in the church world now, you know? Um, I think a funny one, uh, John Crist, you know, that comedian that

Frank Barry:
Oh,

Joby Martin:
kind of

Frank Barry:
yes, 100%.

Joby Martin:
train wrecked his life for a minute. He's got one called net positive. Have you listened to that?

Frank Barry:
I have not listened to that one. I see him on Instagram all the time, he cracks me up.

Joby Martin:
So it's that, imagine an hour of that kind of junk.

Frank Barry:
Right.

Joby Martin:
It's him and two dudes in there and they're believers, but they kind of make fun of church

Frank Barry:
They

Joby Martin:
and

Frank Barry:
totally do.

Joby Martin:
also

Frank Barry:
It's hysterical.

Joby Martin:
try to explain to all the other people who aren't church people, like what,

Frank Barry:
What's

Joby Martin:
you

Frank Barry:
going

Joby Martin:
know,

Frank Barry:
on?

Joby Martin:
like what's see what the poll is or whatever, you know, it's, I mean, so that one's pretty funny. The Meat Eater podcast, listen to that, you know about

Frank Barry:
Yup.

Joby Martin:
Steve Ronella

Frank Barry:
Yeah,

Joby Martin:
and Meat

Frank Barry:
yeah.

Joby Martin:
Eater, yes,

Frank Barry:
Totally.

Joby Martin:
that's a good one. Yeah.

Frank Barry:
All right, that's good. That's good. Okay, last one. Where do people need to go to get the book? They just go to JobyMartin.com.

Joby Martin:
Yep. You can get it there or I'm supposed to say in anywhere books are sold.

Frank Barry:
and anywhere

Joby Martin:
I'm supposed to say

Frank Barry:
but

Joby Martin:
that every time.

Frank Barry:
JobyMartin.com and anywhere books

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
are sold.

Joby Martin:
Yeah. Wherever you can get it, wherever.

Frank Barry:
So good. So good. Well, Pastor Joby, you go Pastor Joby or Pastor Martin? What's the

Joby Martin:
Uh, most people call me pastor. Joe B if they were going to say the pastor word in there. Yeah.

Frank Barry:
Respect, respect. Thank

Joby Martin:
Yeah.

Frank Barry:
you for coming on. This has been great. I appreciate your story. I appreciate, you know, seeing what God's been doing through you and the church out there. It's been really cool. So thanks for coming on the show today.

Joby Martin:
Man, my pleasure. Hey, and thanks for all that you do. Cause there's a bunch of guys like us that maybe can rightly divide the word, but we have no idea how to do all those techie kind of things that folks like you are gifted to do. So

Frank Barry:
Amen, I'll-

Joby Martin:
without guys like you, we're just a guy with a bullhorn on the street corner. So thanks.

Frank Barry:
We're all playing our part, you know, having a good time using our gifts to build up the church. So love that. Well, maybe we'll get you back on another day. But thanks for today. Thanks guys for joining us. Definitely listen to this podcast, share it with your friends, tell your family members. But we'll see you next week on another episode of Modern Church Leader. Bye bye.

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